An (almost) daily conversation about my process of preparation to apply for acceptance to the MFA Acting programs at Juilliard, NYU-Tisch and the Yale School of Drama in 2012.
Confession: I've been procrastinating writing this post...You know..it's my "HOW DID AUDITIONS GO THIS YEAR?" post.
Ugh.
I have been putting a lot of expectations on myself about how it "should be"... How this post should be "profound and inspiring" or "hilariously funny" or "heartfelt and poignant." It's probably not going to be any of those things. Sorry!
In order to get me to actually sit down and write this post, I needed to let go of all of those "should" expectations and allow myself to write a boring, factual, short and simple account of what occurred at my MFA auditions this year (and how it felt).
Now... it sounds like I'm about to say that all my auditions went terrible this 4th year of applying and that's why it's been so hard to write about them! That's definitely not the case. I've just been in avoidance-mode. That's all.
Anyhoo...avoidance no more!
Here is the run-down:
OLD GLOBE (UNIVERSITY OF SAN DIEGO) MFA - ACTING
Audition Location: Ripley-Grier Studios, NYC
Audition Date: Thursday, January 24, 2013
Application/Audition Fee: $55
How many times have I auditioned here?: Twice (2010 & 2013)
How'd it go?: Awesome. Felt great!
Callback?: No. (But that's okay because Old Globe doesn't have callbacks.)
What happens next?: Now just waiting to hear from them.
NYU GRAD ACTING
Audition Location: Tisch, 721 Broadway, NYC
Audition Date: Friday, January 25, 2013
Application/Audition Fee: $60
How many times have I auditioned here?: Four times (2010, 2011, 2012, 2013)
How'd it go?: Awesome. Felt great! Had fun.
Callback?: Yes. Made it through same-day-second-round-callbacks with Mark Wing-Davey. That's as far as you can get on the day of auditions. Yay!
What happens next?: Now just waiting to hear if I will get invited to the "final callback weekend" in March.
(Read more detailed accounts of my previous audition experiences at NYU here: 2010, 2011 and 2012.)
JUILLIARD MFA - ACTING
Audition Location: The Juilliard School, Lincoln Center Plaza, NYC
Audition Date: Saturday, January 26, 2013
Application/Audition Fee: $110
How many times have I auditioned here?: Twice (2012 & 2013)
How'd it go?: Awesome. Very emotional day. Felt really wonderful to have the opportunity to audition for them again. I had the best audition experience last year...and this year was just as fun/awesome!
Callback?: Yes. Made it through same-day-second-round-callbacks, the group-work and to a final interview at the end of the day.
What happens next?: I will receive an email tomorrow to tell me if I've been invited to the "final callback weekend" in March.
(Read a more detailed account of last year's audition experience at Juilliard here: 2012. And here is a link to my most popular post during the project, "The Juilliard Door Closes," about how it feels to NOT get accepted to your top-choice school.)
YALE MFA - ACTING
Audition Location: Yale University, New Haven, CT
Audition Date: Sunday, February 3, 2013
Application/Audition Fee: $110
How many times have I auditioned here?: Four times (2010, 2011, 2012, 2013)
How'd it go?: Awesome. They are always very nice.
Callback?: No.
What happens next?: No need to wait. Because I did not receive a callback, I know that I am not being considered for this year's class. (But thank you for sending me my rejection letter email today, Yale... on Valentine's day. Very sensitive. Very sensitive, indeed...Ha!)
(Read more detailed accounts of my previous audition experiences at Yale here: 2010/2011 and 2012.)
And now for FEEEEEELINGS...
My goal for this year's auditions was to challenge myself to throw a chair in EVERY audition. (Special thanks to Kevin Morales who suggested that I work in the chair throw to my Shakespeare monologue. Totally justified with the given circumstances of the play and the journey of the character in the monologue.) Still, this felt TERRIFYING to me. And that's EXACTLY why I had to do it.
It felt like a huge RISK for me every time. Which meant that something REAL was a stake in my performance!!!
Thoughts like this would run through my head...
- What if the chair breaks? (One of them did break...first round at NYU. Yikes!)
- What if they think I'm crazy? (So what if they do?! Would I want to attend a graduate acting program that didn't allow the students to make big/risky choices in class? NO! So if they think I'm crazy for throwing a chair, then that's probably NOT the program for me....And maybe I am a little bit crazy, anyway...just sayin'.)
- What if they don't "like" me or think that it's not "nice" to throw a chair? (Ugh. I call this "nice girl syndrome." F@%K that! Get over yourself, Virginia! This isn't about them liking YOU in this monologue...This is about you communicating the journey of this Shakespearean character and if throwing a chair helps tell that story (which I think it did) then you'd better not be a cowardly chickens*^t and back down and be "polite" just because you're afraid of offending somebody. That said...when I did break one chair...I did apologize politely afterwards.)
Four years ago...I NEVER would have had the balls to throw a chair in an audition, MFA or otherwise. I would have talked myself out of it...and justified every possible reason why it was a terrible idea...every time.
But...now...I feel proud...because I not only threw a chair in every audition...I still got called back at NYU and Juilliard!!! AWESOME!
It just goes to show...Sometimes the "rules" we superimpose on ourselves are TOTAL bulls!@t and should be broken. There is no "right" way in this life. Take a RISK!!! It feels amazing to know that you can! Even if you break a chair...you will survive!!! F*~k Yeah!
(Geez, lots of expletives in this post. Perhaps I should have given a disclaimer at the beginning. This post is PG-13.... "Nice girl syndrome" strikes again. Ha!)
Anyways, that's how it went...and a little bit about how I felt about it.
So check back with me for Update #4 soon...very soon...since I'll be getting an email from Juilliard tomorrow.
Eeeeeeeee!
Thank you for reading....Thank you for all of your good energy and well-wishes during my auditions. It was all deeply felt and much appreciated.
Sending sooooo much love to all of you courageous people who are on this journey too!
Dream BIG...and do not give up!
Loves,
Virginia
"Look where you have ended up right now. This is exactly where you need to be, so don't resist. Pay attention to what is showing up for you and use that as the guidance for where your next step lies. If it does not feel good and expansive, you have work to do It's not about them and what they decide or do. It is about you and your process, so take responsibility for that. Be flexible and don't blame." - Lena Stevens, The Power Path
I cannot BELIEVE this is the second-to-last post of the Acceptance Project!!!Whoooooo hoooooo! Almost DONE!
Now, in the interest of full-disclosure and transparency and getting over my own fear...I am posting videos of my four audition monologues and my a capella song for you to see. I've embedded them below.
Why has this taken sooooo long for me to get to posting these monologues? (Grad school auditions took place back in January, after all.)
I have one word for you:
RESISTANCE
"Resistance cannot be seen, touched, heard or smelled. But it can be felt. It is experienced as a force field emanating from a work-in-potential. It's a repelling force. It's negative. Its intention is to shove the creator away, distract him, sap his energy, incapacitate him.
If Resistance wins, the work doesn't get written...
Resistance seems to come from outside ourselves. We locate it in spouses, jobs, bosses, kids, distractions. "Peripheral opponents," as Pat Riley used to say when he coached the Los Angeles Lakers.
Resistance is not a peripheral opponent. Resistance arises from within. It is self-generated and self-perpetuated. Resistance is the enemy within."
Even though I KNEW in my gut that I HAD to post my monologues for you all to see...EVENTUALLY. I procrastinated it to the 11th hour (a.k.a. NOW...the second-to-last post.) And I'm procrastinating another thing for tomorrow's blog post too...So I'll probably be publishing that one at like 11:55pm on April 1st. ;-P
Anyhoo...RESISTANCE. Let's talk about that for a sec...
The one and only one thing that is coming between YOU and you moving in the direction of your dreams is...(sing with me now)...Reeeeeeesiiiiiiiiissstaaaaaaance!!!
What is keeping you from doing what you KNOW in your heart-of-hearts you are capable of doing????
Let's use ME as an example here...
Me = Queen of Resistance & Duchess of Rationalization
Here are some of the fantastical thoughts that went through my head as I considered the undertaking of posting my monologues publicly on the blog:
I can't. I don't know how to upload video on to YouTube. I've never done it before.
It's going to look stupid because I don't have a real camera. I just have my iPhone.
I hate watching myself on camera. My acting is always waaaay too big. And I am going to look ridiculous.
If I post this online, anyone will be able to view it...even potentially ~gasp~ casting professionals. What if they don't like my work and I get a reputation for being a "bad" actor?
I don't have time. It's going to take FOREVER to figure out how to do this.
I hate asking for help, but I'll never be able to figure this out on my own. Who would possibly agree to help me with this project? I can't PAY anyone to help me. They'd have to do it out of the goodness of their heart. I don't want to IMPOSE on anyone.
I'd have to shoot this after work one day and I'm going to be exhausted and the light might be all gone and shooting at night might be hard. I don't know what to expect since I've never done this before.
And here's what I told myself to be able to get all my resistant thoughts to SHUT UP...and let me do my WORK already:
Even though I have never uploaded any video to YouTube before, I know TONS of people who do that alllll the time, so it really can't be that hard. If I allow my self enough time, I'm sure I can figure it out. And if I need help I can think of at least 3 people off-the-top-of-my-head that I could call to assist me. No problem.
Even though I only have an iPhone to record with...that's FINE. It doesn't need to be super high quality. The purpose of me posting these videos is not to win cinematography awards, it is to RECORD a snapshot in time of where I am at with these monologues that I worked on this year. That's allllll. An iPhone is a perfectly adequate tool for this purpose.
So what if your acting is too big? So what if you look ridiculous? Who cares? YOU ARE A WORK IN PROGRESS and so are these monologues. There are going to be moments in the pieces that you LOVE and are proud of...and things that you see that you'd like to improve. (DON'T LET THE PERFECT BE THE ENEMY OF THE GOOD! That's what I've been telling myself from day one of this blog.) Don't judge yourself! Get SOMETHING up there! You've shared soooooo much about this entire experience through your writing. Don't chicken-out now! Be courageous! Show your acting work! That's what this is all about, right? Some people will love it and some people with think it's total crap...That's okay. Either way...you will have overcome your fear of showing your work...in all it's flawed glory...AND THAT'S SUCCESS.
As for casting folks...the ones that see it and don't like it...probably won't contact me. But there may be people that see it and think..."Hey, I've got a project that girl might be right for...Let me email her and give her a shot." OR....If I get a lot of really negative feedback on it...I can always take it down...re-shoot...and try again. It's a learning process...And I can get better at it...but only if I start somewhere.
Time? Reaaaaally, Virginia? If you have time to watch Failure Club on Yahoo! Screen (my favorite show right now), then you have time to get on your computer and figure out how to make this YouTube uploading thing happen. Just start by logging-in to the website. Start there. The rest will happen naturally. Oh! And make an appointment on your calendar to shoot the video. If you don't schedule it into your life...it ain't gonna happen.
Get over your issue about ASKING FOR HELP!...You know you've got people in your life that would love to support you in this project and have the skills to easily make this happen. AND it'll be waaaaay more fun to collaborate with someone awesome on this project. Call MATT STEINER! You just saw that he uploaded his CLOWN REEL onto his website. He could totally help you....AND HE DID!!!! (Thanks, Matt. You are the BEST. Thank you. These videos would NOT have happened without you. Had a BLAST working on this with you. So. Much. Fun.)
Go for it. Work with what you've got...So you've got some lighting issues? Whatever. It's fine...as long as you're not in the dark, you're okay...So the sound is not so great. We can bump up the volume as best we can when we're editing...and we'll do the best we can...Get going NOW, because this blog is ending on April 1st and it's gotta get done!!!....So you've only gotten 4 hours of sleep on top of a loooooong week of uber-stress at work? Yeah. Boo-hoo Wilcox. There's never going to be a perfect circumstance. So take it from where you are at and that's a PERFECT place to start these monologues. Go with it. Use it. Use whatever energy you have...and go from there. That's all you can do.
Sooooo that was how I overcame my resistance to posting these monologues.
True story.
Now...without further ado...My audition monologues for Juilliard, NYU and Yale 2012...
Virginia: Okay, we’ve talked a lot about good audition advice. What is the worst piece of audition advice that you’ve ever gotten?
Bryce: Hmmm...(Thinking.)
Virginia: Can I share with you mine?
Bryce: Yeah.
Virginia: "Just show up." People say that "showing up is half the battle." I’m like, "NO! That’s like the last two percent." And sure, yeah, if you don’t show up, you're not going to get the job, but STILL...
Bryce: There’s a difference between being relaxed and allowing for whatever is going to happen to happen and just showing up. Yeah, if you show up, but you show up unprepared... then, you know, nobody’s happy...
I’d encourage people to just treat the situation for what it is, admit what’s going on in the room. Sometimes you get in there and you feel like it’s just hard to be a human being all of a sudden -- It’s hard to say hello to someone and goodbye to someone or introduce yourself. I don’t know why this happens to us. I do know it’s nerves and fear, but if you can just try and do things like walk at normal speeds and say goodbye and have a nice day and thank you to your reader in particular. I always try to say thanks. That’s one thing, having been a reader, a reader can really help you a lot in an audition. Again, that’s more for professional auditions than it is in grad school. But I don’t like when people pretend that something is going on that’s not going on. They forgot the line. They forgot the words. Just stop, say I’m sorry, I forgot the words. They don’t care. They want you to get it right. They want you to do well. Everybody in an audition wants you to do well. Nobody wants you to suck.
Virginia: I have a grad school audition question.
Bryce: Yeah, sure.
Virginia: You got to observe a lot of the auditions for Yale after you had been accepted, right?
Bryce: Yeah, you can do that if you want.
Virginia: Did anyone ever ask to direct their monologue to you while you were in the room?
Bryce: No. But if you’re considering….
Virginia: I mean, obviously Ron and Walton don’t want you to direct your monologue to them. They want to be able to watch you.
Bryce: Yeah.
Virginia: But is it appropriate to ask to direct your monologue to a grad student or someone, if they're in the room?
Bryce: Well, I think you should ask, if you want to use somebody, whether it’s the auditioner – which I don’t recommend -- or somebody else in the room, a student, or a reader, what have you. I ask readers who have been brought to the audition to interact with people. For example, if I’m singing a song to someone in particular, I ask, "Can I use you for the song? Do you mind if I sing this song to you?"...
You know, usually it works out great....But whatever...it’s helpful to me, and hopefully they enjoy it. I don’t know. But in terms of grad school auditions, I would say... yes, but be prepared for them to say no. If you say, "Can I use one of you guys for this monologue?" And Ron or Walton or whoever says, "No, I’d rather you actually just did the monologue." Just be prepared for that reality, so that you’re not committed in one way. "I have to do this to somebody or it’s not going to be good."
Virginia: But in your experience at Yale, did that ever happen while you were in the room?
Bryce: I never saw that happen, no.
Virginia: Everybody would just do their monologue, pick a point on the wall and speak?
Bryce: Yeah, I mean... I wouldn’t say pick a point on the wall. I would say the gaze is probably in some general direction.
Virginia: But they’re not talking to a person.
Bryce: They’re talking to a person... But the reason I stop you at "looking at a point on the wall" is just because I think for me, in my experience of doing those things, it’s easier to actually go into what I would call a "soft focus" and imagine a person there... as opposed to finding the middle of the room and saying it to the exit sign, you know?...Which I’ve also done... If it helps, find the exit sign and just sing to it.
You’ve done all the preparation. Don’t let the nerves of the moment interfere with all that. Take the time to remind yourself of your breath and also...whatever you've come up with...Okay, this is the person I’m talking to, this is what I need from them, and this is why. And this is what just happened [in the scene]... And, again, imagine they’re right over there, and I’m going to start. As opposed to,...okay, they’re running late so they probably need the next person in here, and I’ll just pick a point on the wall and start.... Again, it’s your time, you’ve done the work, you paid money to be there.
Virginia: A lot, yeah.
Bryce: So I’m not saying get in there and do your warm-ups in front of them. Please do not do that.
Virginia: (Laughs.)
Bryce: But feel free to take your time to make sure you’re breathing and start the way you want to start. I don’t advocate stopping if you feel -- oh, it’s not going exactly the way I want it. First, you can never control what they say. You can only control what you do. And if you feel like you’ve drastically gone away from what you said you wanted to do, then you can say, "I’m sorry, I’d like to start again. May I start again? Take your time again and start." But again there’s something about the insistence or the boldness of a proposal that is worth more to me on the other side of that table than the person that comes in and gets all the beats right or puts the emphasis on the right word as opposed to comes in and lays the meat on the table... "That’s my audition!" You know?
Virginia: Okay, so I want to finish up by talking about your current project (Ghost:The Musical), and just ask you a couple of questions about that. When do you guys go into previews?
Bryce: We start previews March 15,2012 and we open in April 23, 2012.
Virginia: Tell me about the project and how you came to be involved.
Bryce: I am going to be originating for Broadway! -- I say that because it’s going to be very exciting. Remember we talked about the little kid who like gets to say stuff? It’s in these moments where I have to force myself to say those things because the easy path would be to say, "Oh, I’m doing Ghost. But the more fun path, the part that you feel like... not only have I earned this, but I have to see it in this way in order to give it the value it deserves and give it the effort it deserves.-- So I’ll be originating for Broadway the role of Carl in Ghost:The Musical, which is currently running in London. I’m going over there on Tuesday to see the show and meet the cast.
Virginia: They’re flying you out?
Bryce: Yes.
Virginia: Cool.
Bryce: They’re flying me out, and I’m getting fitted for a harness, so yes.
Virginia: Do you get to fly?
Bryce: Well, there will be some certain moments that involve harnesses. I’ll say no more than that.
(Here's a video clip of the Broadway cast's trip to London!!!)
Bryce: How I got involved is... I auditioned.
I just remembered this the other day -- This will be good -- I originally auditioned for the Patrick Swayze role - Sam. I originally auditioned for that for a workshop that they were doing in London with the intent of maybe doing a production of it, two years ago...And I auditioned for the role Patrick Swayze played in Ghost on the day that Patrick Swayze died....And I remember thinking at the time, this is just weird. And it was, again, one of those moments where I was thinking, if I think too much about this, I’m not going to be able to go in and do this audition.
Virginia: Right, you’ve just got to let that go.
Bryce: And I went in and did the audition. Yeah, it was fine. I think it was okay. I didn’t think it was my best. But the director sat me down and talked with me. And then I never heard back. And I thought, okay, well... And then here we are a year and a half, two years later, and I get a call to come in and audition for the friend, the part that Tony Goldman plays in the movie. And I went back and I looked at the script, having remembered going in for the other role before. And I had this realization of... oh, yeah, this is the part I would want to play anyway.
Patrick Swayze’s was a great role, obviously. It was super important. But there’s something about this guy that’s more interesting to me as an artist looking to tackle something. And so that’s what got me psyched to go back in and say, I know I wasn’t right for that guy but check this out. Which is sort of the attitude I try to take a lot in auditions is... "Look, check this out, check me out." Sometimes it’s hard to back up because I feel like…
Virginia: This might not be a good fit.
Bryce: ….this might not be it. I probably had tried to do that attitude when I went in for the Patrick Swayze, check this out, and it didn’t work. Fine...But this time I really felt like, oh, yeah, something about this is more exciting, makes more sense. I know where to start with this. And so we did about 3 – 4 callbacks I think.
After I had a second callback, the next day I had a call to go and meet the director, and did that. You know, I sat down with him and chatted. I had a really sort of like interview, really. And that was on a Sunday, and I was expecting, you know, like next week, Monday or Tuesday I’m going to find out about this. And a month and a half went by and I didn’t hear anything, so I thought okay, that’s gone. I’d really --
Virginia: Let it go.
Bryce: -- completely had let it go. I sort of had forgotten about it, honestly. And then another call, yeah, they still can’t make up their minds. Would you come back in? I said, of course I’ll come back in. So I did and we did another one of those, as I mentioned before, auditioned with tons of people and on video, you know, sending it to London, so people could see it.
At that time, I was like, well , I know what I’ve done in the past, and I know I’m not going to do anything worse than that. If anything, I’m going to do even better. So I had that confidence. They like me enough to bring me back in. Now I just have to go in and do what I do and enjoy it and stand behind it completely. So that’s what I did. I mean, I say it so easily, like yeah, that’s all I did,...but it was terrifying.
Virginia: Right.
Bryce: Terrifying and nerve wracking to get the call that I got... It was like BRILLIANT! I mean, I was screaming in the streets. So it’s like, as much as it pays to play it cool and say, "yeah, it’s no big deal," there’s also a little kid inside that’s doing backflips.
:-)
Virginia: Yeah. So what do you think is going to be your greatest challenge in tackling this role?
Bryce: Well, I think there’s a trap in this role which is, when I tell people who I’m playing, they say, oh, you’re the "bad guy?" And that’s a trap of both the genre of musical theatre and also just the way we see stories, a little two dimensional... or a little "Disney-ified"...
So I think the challenge will be to make him more than just a "bad guy" in a sort of archetypal sense. I think the challenge will be to make him "a guy" and to make him believable as someone who could make such a terrible, terrible decision and then make even worse ones as he goes on. Which is initially what interested me... I want to investigate a guy who is on the other side of a really, really bad decision that turned out really bad, as bad as it gets, the death of his best friend. And what does he choose to do in that moment, save himself? Or come clean? Or what are his choices?
Virginia: Right.
Bryce: And why does he go the way he does? 'Cause that’s interesting to me. It’s interesting to me to investigate these guys who work in the world of finance where everything seems limitless and, you know, they’re motivated by something else. And he must have felt in some way untouchable to go after this thing that he went after which was putting a friend at risk.
So you know, all that and at the same time it’s Ghost. It’s like a great movie, and it’s fun to play a bad guy, right?
Virginia: Right.
Bryce: So it’s balancing those two things. I’m not going to take it so seriously...like I’m talking about it like it’s Shakespere....But at the same time I’m not going to just put on my villain hat and say "good to go." So I think the challenge is making it three dimensional and believable.
Virginia: So how do you think that your three years at Yale, particularly, helped prepare you to approach a great opportunity and a challenge like this, to get to originate a role on Broadway?
Bryce: Well, I always say that after the stuff I went through in grad school, and I mean that in a positive way, like the performance I told you about --downstairs at the Yale Cabaret, and some of the projects you do as a student there, under little sleep and no energy and the things – nothing will scare me more than the stuff that I had to do there. I know I’ll never be as scared as I was at certain moments. And so that prepares me knowing that I will be very nervous doing this, you know, when we actually get to performance. And I’m already nervous about the first day of rehearsal, but I’ve made friends with those nerves in a way that I know that I will come out on the other side ‘cause I came out on the other side of that other stuff.
So that’s sort-of battle preparation. But in terms of approaching a role and finding a place to start – I think that often the hard part is... Where do I start with this?...Yale taught me to seek out those challenges of my character or... what’s exciting about this guy. What is the part of this character that you can attach to, that you can say, yeah, I get that actually? That’s always a challenge. I’m not a Wall Street banker that bet money on his best friend’s life. But I know what it feels like to be on the other side of a really bad decision, not ones with those stakes. But I’ve made really bad decisions before, and I know what that feels like in my stomach. So why don’t I start there, and then see what we can build on top of that. And if it doesn’t work, we’ll tear the whole thing down and we’ll start from a different place. So I think it’s about knowing, having the confidence of just starting and making choices because, one thing, Yale doesn’t give you time to think too much because you have so much on your plate. You literally just have to DO in order to get it done. And you come to realize...it’s a better choice because I had to make it – not on the fly -- but I had to make it fairly quickly. And it got me along faster, so that by the time we were in tech, I had a performance built up that I could go through again during tech and say, "What do I really want to do here? Should I do that? Should I do this?" Not like, "Oh, my God, what am I doing?" You’ve already said, "Now give this choice up. You made this choice, it didn’t work, took half of each, put them together, now I’m doing this. Awesome. Let’s go."
So Yale also prepared me to shed things well. You learn to trust people who are telling you things. Because you realize through feeling yourself progress that your teachers know a lot and that they want you to be better. And what they’re telling you is only meant to make you better. Whether it does or not remains to be seen, but their intent is always positive. So it helped me learn to trust and distrust outside voices.
Virginia: Be mindful of listening to your own self.
Bryce: Yes. And to question other people’s viewpoints. I think the most important thing it did for me is it gave me a sense that I am an individual artist with an opinion and an approach that is worthy of being in a rehearsal room. And worthy of being expressed... not in an overbearing way and not in a timid way... but somewhere in between. "I agree with you that he’s this but I don’t agree that he’s this." Maybe we can have a discussion about it and find a common ground. Or "Gosh, maybe I’m wrong. You’re actually totally right. Thank you for allowing me to talk through my choice to realize that it was wrong."
Virginia: So we’ve got to wrap up. Is there anything else that you want to express to the blog readers? Words of encouragement?
Bryce: Yeah, I would just say, you know, try -- as hard as it may be -- try and breathe through the entire thing. It sounds "widgy woo woo" but it’s true, remind yourself to breathe... Breathe. Be bold in your choices. And, as I said before, don’t bring in something you’re not proud of. Make us something – bring a gift into the audition room that is something you’re proud to bring as opposed to something you think we want to see.
Virginia: I think that’s great.
Bryce: Yeah, I think that’s it.
Virginia: That’s awesome. Thank you, Bryce.
[End of recording.]
Just have to say how wonderful it was to use this blog as an excuse to sit down with Bryce and get to ask him ANYTHING I WANTED...all under the guise of providing a inspirational interview for the blog...Which is also an outcome of the effort.
It was a joy to get to talk about creative process with a man that has grown sooooo much from the first time I met him...when we were 13-year-old tap-dancing ensemble members of Stars 2000's Teen Theatre production of Anything Goes in Northern CA.
Wishing you a hugely successful run of Ghost: The Musical , Bryce, and continued challenges that lead to artistic growth and a life-long career in the performing arts...both, making a living and living your dreams!
Loves,
Virginia
"You will always have more to learn. Even if you're the best of the best, there is always room for improvement. But at the same time, there will always be people with less experience and skill than you, who will consider you an expert, and find value in what you have to offer." - Dan Johnson, Right Brain Rockstar
"Some actors just have an inherent star quality. When I'm watching an audition, I think, "Is that actor going to make me stop flipping through channels?" Basically, someone who has immense watchablility in combination with acting ability and confidence. The truth of it is, when producers and networks set out to cast a show, there's always a bit of insecurity about being able to find the right person. I believe part of the actor's job is to show us his or her confidence in doing the role." - Marcia Shulman, Casting Director
(This is PART THREE of the interview with Yale graduate Bryce Pinkham. Click HERE to read PART ONE and HERE to read PART TWO. This interview was conducted at Cellini Restaurant on E. 54th St. in New York City on January 6, 2012, and was lovingly transcribed by my mother, Dorothy Wilcox. Thanks, MOM!)
Virginia: So at this point in your career, you’ve gotten the chance to work with a lot of great people on different projects, at school and outside of school. And how much do you feel that this idea of embracing failure or leaning into fear, rather than pushing away from it,.... you know, that kind of an attitude, is a factor in being successful in a career as an actor?
Bryce: I think it works differently for different people. But I think any actor that you respect as an artist would be able to rattle off numerous times that they were terrible or felt like a failure. I think that it’s inherent in the attempt. And I think for people who can’t admit that or those that fail to rearrange their relationship or value towards failure, that it can be difficult because – listen, we talked about auditioning. We fail 90% of the time by the numbers. I don’t even know what the numbers are – one out of ten, who knows? I’ve failed more times than jobs that I’ve had. The entire number of jobs that I’ve had in three years out of grad school, it doesn’t match up to the number of jobs that I’ve failed to get in one year. So, you know, proportionately it makes sense to make friends with that part of the job. And I think there are plenty of people who do it and do it well. So it relaxes you. A lot of this stuff you learn in grad school, it relaxes you so that you can allow your most honest moments to come up and come out and so that you can express something unique as opposed to shaping something that you think is what the audience or the director or your scene partner wants to see in you.
So I think rearranging you position on failure relaxes you because you realize it’s inevitable. So you don’t have to wait and say, "Well, what if this is the one where I fail?" Well, chances are I will, so why don’t I just enjoy the pursuit and also do the thing I really want to do. What’s the thing in this audition or in this performance of a character that excites me, that I want to work on, that I want to explore as an artist? Because in the end, you know, that’s what you get out of it...
And truth be told -- in certain situations failure is not an option, right? I mean, there are different levels of it. I’m not saying it’s okay to go out on a Broadway stage and suck. But it’s okay to out on a Broadway AUDITION and suck and say, "That was terrible, wasn’t it, can I try again? ‘Cause I know I can do it better than that. That was just messy." So there’s a difference, to be clear.
Virginia: I was reading a blog from this great blogger that I really enjoy, Seth Godin. He’s really into business and marketing and things like that, you know, entrepreneurialism and the tech world. And you know, those startups fail all the time. People start a new business and it fails and they learn from it and they go on and start a different one and it fails. So it’s very similar to the acting world in the way, that you know you're going in with this idea, this dream, this vision of what you want to create and you have to get other people on board with it and sometimes it’s awesome and sometimes it’s terrible. You know, we as artists have to do that all the time...get these people on board. And Seth was talking about, in one of his blogs, the difference between mistakes and failure. He’s like, you want to avoid mistakes and you want to embrace failure. I think in our work as actors, you want to walk into an audition trying to avoid the mistakes.... but big-time embracing the failure... because that’s the thing that’s going to help you to succeed – I love what you said about bringing that uniqueness to it. You’re not there to get it RIGHT. You’re there to bring whatever it is that you feel that you can uniquely bring to that job. And if you’re so busy trying to get it "right" that you don’t bring that uniqueness... then, you know, that’s a MISTAKE.
Bryce: Well, as it relates to grad school auditions, I think if you try, as I said, embracing the ridiculousness of the whole thing, if you take a minute and think, okay, Yale sees this many auditions a year and this is the number that they take, these are my odds. If you really take that seriously, you probably wouldn’t even walk in the room. And it’s the reason that half the people that do walk in the rooms are not interesting the minute they walk in because they’re already apologizing for the fact that they don’t think they’re right, or they don’t think they’re what the school is looking for...as opposed to people who walk in and say, well, I may go down but I’m going to go down in flames. That’s not from me. That’s from a teacher of mine who said that to us, I think, on our first day of grad school. He said, "You’re going to go down, but it’s your choice whether or not to go down in flames." So I try to do that as much as I can bear.
Virginia: So you try to go down in flames as often as possible? :)
Bryce: If I’m going down, yes. I say if I’m going to make a choice that could be "wrong" or "not what they’re looking for," at least it’s going to be a strong choice. It’s going to be a BOLD choice. I’m not going to hint at making a choice. I’m going to make it, and then if they say, "You know what, that was not really what we were looking for. Could you try this?" I’m going to say, "Absolutely. Sure. Let me just ditch that terrible choice that I made and then I’d be happy to do whatever you’d like."
This is something else for auditioning I try to embody... This is something I learned I think from Joanna Merlin’s book about auditioning way back in undergrad. I read about treating the audition as if it is actually a party that you’re hosting and everyone there is looking to you for their enjoyment, but you’re also a little bit in charge, not even a little bit, YOU'RE IN CHARGE. The minute you walk into the room you say, "Oh thank you for all joining me at my party, and what can I get you? Would you like a song first? Would you like me to do a scene that I’ve prepared for you first? Oh, you would? Excellent choice. I’ve prepared this beautiful little cake of a scene and you can have a piece now. There’s more of it if you’d like, but please don’t feel you have to eat it all. I’ve also got a song, if you’d like to hear that. I’m very proud of it." And even the best party hosts [have bad days], maybe the cake is burned and the punch is, you know, bad... But the way they present it is half the battle, I think. I always tell people when I’m coaching them for specific auditions, not necessarily for grad school but for more professional stuff, you don’t have to get out of the room right away. Nobody leaves their own party until they're done. I’m not saying... refuse to leave. But what I’m saying is... you don’t have to finish, [speaks very quickly] okay, thank you so much for seeing me. I’m outta here! [slows down, speaking pleasantly, calmly] Thank you so much. Can I get you anything else?...It’s just a different sort of –
Virginia: -- attitude.
Bryce: -- yeah, it’s a different way of approaching the entire thing. And it’s also a way of approaching people when you show up. TAKE YOUR TIME.... I mean, I take my time, and I say hi to everybody in the room. I look them in the eyes. I say hello. Or if it feels like it’s something that’s moving along, I try not to overstay my welcome. But I try not to let people rush me.
Virginia: Right. It’s your moment.
Bryce: Right. I prepared. I spent hours out of my precious time preparing for this. And whether or not you’ve already decided that I’m not the one for this part, that’s fine. That’s you. But for me, I’ve prepared the song, and I’m going to sing it. If you want to stop me in the middle of it, I’m fine with that because "I’m the party host," and I say, "Oh, sure, I’m sorry that was not exactly what you were hoping for. But my intent is that you’re going to eat all of the cake, and you’re going to love it... ‘cause I took time to make it."
Virginia: I love that.
Bryce: And I’m proud of that cake I made... That’s the other thing I always tell people, and this is important in the clown work– and I think I‘ve told you this before – in choosing material, never bring something into the room that you’re not proud of because we can tell. Even if it’s the mangiest little gift, you know, the little burned cake... But if you made it yourself and it’s one you’re proud of, it’s one YOU LIKE, it’s going to taste that much better to us, rather than the one you bought at Whole Foods... And it’s going to mean that much more to us, that you brought it and you thought about it. "I bet they’d really like this special nut cake. I’m not exactly sure how to do it, but I’m going to try." As opposed to, "Well, I could just pick up an ice cream cake at Baskin Robbins." -- to put in a youthful reference, 31 Flavors.
Virginia: Nice.
Bryce: So yeah, I hope that’s helpful.
Virginia: Oh, my gosh, that’s fantastic!...This is just a fun little question not really related to grad school. What advice would you give to your 16-year-old self if you could send yourself a little note back in time?
Bryce: Stretch, start stretching, stretch.
Virginia: Like physically stretching?
Bryce: Stretch yourself every day. I hated stretching. I was an athlete and I just hated warming up. And I hated stretching. And I would go back, and I would really slap myself around and I would say–
Virginia: Learn to love it.
Bryce: Yeah, learn to love it. Get used to the pleasure/pain of it and stretch yourself. I would also tell myself to learn piano. Yeah, I mean, there are technical things like that.... Hmmm, 16.... I’m trying to think of advice or criticism....I’m pretty happy with where 16-year-old me got me, so I wouldn’t want him to do anything that much different.
Virginia: Well, there ya go!
Bryce: Other than... not worry maybe so much about it. There’s a healthy amount of worry and then there’s an unhealthy amount...When you get in to "living in the details" as opposed to seeing a slightly bigger picture...Which is what I still say that to my 29-year-old self right now.
Virginia: Right.
Bryce: You know, sometimes you have to really marvel at the fact that we’re even able to do something as ridiculous as follow a dream like this. There are people in our world that... it’s just inconceivable to them. You have to remind yourself of that. Even when it’s not working out, it’s a privilege to even get to TRY and to have the means and the support from family and friends and everything. To be able to do it, you know what I mean?
Virginia: Yes! <3
Bryce: I would say,... You know what? BE HUMBLE... because the fact that you’re even thinking about going to college is a big deal. That’s a BIG DEAL, going to college. Families go whole generations without sending somebody to college, so take none of it lightly.
:-)
(More to come...tomorrow. Hope you're enjoying the conversation!)
Loves,
V
"Stretch, stretch, stretch to see every perspective and nothing will keep you from joy." - Mike Dooley
"The potential not just for failure, but failure that matters, failure you feel, must be on the table. If it's not, then what you're setting out to do is either so safe or so devoid of the potential for impact that success might allow you to check a box on a piece of paper, but beyond that, nobody'll care. Including you...The same circumstance that presents the potential to fail also serves as a gateway to the opportunity to succeed. You cannot close the door on the former, without also closing the door on the latter." - Jonathan Fields
(This is PART TWO of the interview with Yale graduate Bryce Pinkham. Click HERE to read PART ONE. This interview was conducted at Cellini Restaurant on E. 54th St. in New York City on January 6, 2012, and was lovingly transcribed by my mother, Dorothy Wilcox. Thanks, MOM!)
(Yup. Still talking to THIS GUY...Currently starring in Ghost: The Musical on Bway.)
Virginia: Anyway, let’s get to grad school because, you know, that’s what it’s about, allllll about grad school. I have my notes highlighted here.
Bryce: Okay, good, good.
Virginia: Okay, so we’re gonna just throw something out here and see where it goes. So, okay, first question: What do you think are three great reasons to attend grad school, if somebody’s considering, you know, attending grad school?
Bryce: I would say, go to grad school if you have yet to have had the opportunity to explore the depth of your own instrument in an environment that feels safe to do so. For me, I felt like I got to do a lot of stuff in undergrad. I got to perform a lot, which was great. But I wasn’t continually challenged in a way that I felt like I knew exactly what I was working with even as an actor. I didn’t know the sum total of what I could do. I still don’t. But now I know that it’s fun to find out, and I know a little about how to explore it, go after it, and what it feels like when it’s not right...
So I’d say, one, if you feel like you want to further expand yourself as an artist; two, if you want to experience failure. I guess those are similar things, but I went because I wanted – because I hadn’t failed yet. I really hadn’t....I don’t mean that in an egotistical way. I mean that the environment I was in was very supportive, and so it was like no matter what we did, it was awesome -- because it was. But in grad school, it’s a more critical -- in a good way – environment. And it’s more professionally minded. These schools get people trained and prepared for careers as professional actors.
And the last thing I would say is... go to grad school if you feel like making an investment in a long-term vision.
And the opposite of that is... I always tell people...don’t go to grad school to get an agent; don’t go to grad school so that you can say you went to the same school that a famous actor went to; don’t go to grad school for the resume. Go to grad school if you are interested in making a short term investment in a long-term goal.
I know that jives earlier with what I said earlier about I’m giving myself five years. But I think that’s probably one of the mind tricks I play with myself... well, it’s only five years. But, grad school – don’t expect it to be an instant payoff. It’s for the type of people who are willing to audition for three years in a row to get into it, or four or five or however many....So it’s not for people who think it might be fun. It’s an entire overtaking of your life for three years – it really is.
Virginia: That’s funny. My next question was going to be, what are the three reasons NOT to go to grad school. So thank you for answering that and reading my mind.
Bryce: Did I say three?
Virginia: You did actually. I think you said exactly three... Only the transcript will tell... So what schools did you choose when you were auditioning for grad school?
Bryce: I said if I’m going to go to grad school and spend my own money, potentially a lot of it, that I want to go to one of the top schools, what I understand being one of the top schools because there are a lot out there. So I auditioned for Yale and NYU, UCSD, ACT, and ART – because I was in Boston at the time. If I had known a little more, I probably would have auditioned for Juilliard and the Denver Center as well. So I auditioned for Yale in New Haven, at the school, and the rest I auditioned for in New York at NYU. I lumped together as many together in one day as I could. I did three on one day, Yale the next day and then – actually I think I missed my ART audition and had to go into ART -- their auditions in Boston – later.
Virginia: That is insane. Having gone through grad school auditions the past two years, I cannot even imagine doing three in one day. That just seems crazy.
Bryce: It was intense, but at the same time it was helpful because – and I think the third one I actually got into was ACT. And I think because I had just been like sort of pumelled around a little bit, and I felt like I know what this is and I know what to expect from this now, and I’ll just go do it.
Virginia: So how far did you get at each of the schools?
Bryce: NYU, I don’t think they wanted anything to do with me, nor UCSD. And then ACT, ART and Yale all accepted me.
Virginia: Wow. And that was your first year; right?
Bryce: That was my first year, yeah.
Virginia: You were still in undergrad at the time?
Bryce: Yeah. I was a senior in college. It was not my intention to go to grad school the next year. I sort of came to the idea late, and I thought -- you know, when you’re a senior in college, it‘s like there’s so much stuff going on, and you – you know, I was writing a thesis at the time. It was like I’m just going to do this... and I made it my goal to make an impression at each school. That’s where I was capping my goal, so that I took the pressure off myself to get into the "Yale School of Drama." So that’s why three in one day. I was like, well, I’ll just get them out of the way. And I think it really helped me in retrospect because I wasn’t sure that I wanted to do it actually, to be perfectly honest. I am now one of those people that says "Don’t do it unless you really want to." But I think it helped me not think about it in such grand terms. And then when I got in, I was like... okay, well, I guess now I really have to choose, and I did.
Virginia: It’s interesting... in our conversation you’ve mentioned a few of these little mind tricks that you play with yourself where you – and correct me if I’m not reflecting this back accurately – but, you know, it’s like you almost sense that if you think about it a certain way it’s going to cause you anxiety and so you choose to think about it in a way that will lessen that pressure for you.
Bryce: Yeah, you’re right. I do do those things. I would say – I would call it less of a trick and more of just a readjustment of value.
Virginia: Reframing the idea for yourself?
Bryce: Yeah, I mean – I’m trying to think of a good example. Well, it’s about reframing, and it’s also about panning out and taking perspective on a given situation, which happens to me a lot at auditions when, you know, I know I’m going in for a third call back for something and expecting that the entire producing team is going to be in there. It’s not just the casting director and the reader, it’s twelve to fifteen to twenty people. And it’s in one of these studios that has these giant windows. It’s like the back drop of Smash. It’s one of these studios in Times Square. You’re auditioning in one of these rooms for 15 or 20 minutes. And that instantly gets me nervous. It gets me nervous just talking about it. But if I can force myself to pan out from that and say, "Look at yourself, you’re auditioning in New York for whatever Broadway or Off Broadway, for a part in a professional play, musical or whatever, and all these people are here to see you do an amazing job and get the job." And if you can stay in touch with that little kid that looks at that and says are you serious? I’m doing what? Then you can go back to the room and just enjoy the fact that you’re there to start, and not worry about, well, am I going to get everything right, cause you’re never going to get it all right. You’re never going to get it all right in the audition room...
But what you can do is make a good impression. And so I try to give myself that promise. I try to say, don’t worry about all that other stuff. You’re not going to get it all right, so I can just admit that to myself. Today is not the day you get it right.
Virginia: Right.
Bryce: And they all know that, too. They’re not expecting you to get it right. They’re just expecting you to do something that can help them imagine you getting it right on opening night after you’ve had months and months or maybe just weeks of rehearsal.
And same with the grad school auditions – I’ll talk about this now. They’re not looking for an actor that looks just like an actor that came out of the Yale School of Drama. They’re looking for an actor that they’ll think, "Okay, I think this would be really beneficial to have this person in our midst because there’s a lot of room for growth, there’s a passion for the journey, but there’s also a levity about the entire thing."
The other thing I say to myself a lot in the auditions is... "This is ridiculous!"... I mean, let’s call a spade a garden tool. This is RIDICULOUS what you’re asking me to do... come in a small room, maybe a big room, and sing a song that I learned last night because you didn’t get the material until then. You guys, you know, were up late talking about other things. You don’t remember my name, but we know each other. I’m going to sing a song for you that I don’t know. I’m going to pretend that I know it well, and then I’m going to hold these pages with words on them. I’m going to pretend that I memorized them, but I really just had the time to look at them on the train. And at the end of that, you’re going to decide whether or not you want me to have your job. There’s an inherent ridiculousness. They're sitting behind the table taking notes. It’s just ridiculous. But if you can play the game, and at the same time recognize it for what it is, I think you’ll help yourself a lot.
Virginia: That’s great. That’s like solid gold advice!... Okay, so you were talking about grad school stretching you. That being one of the main reasons that you went, to have that experience of failing. So can you share a specific example of something you felt like you failed at so colossally and you learned a lot from it and grew as a result of it?
Bryce: There are so many instances that I can’t pull one out of the ether, off the top of my head... But part of the journey is learning how to collaborate with people in a room after a common objective that sometimes is agreed upon and sometimes is not. And at the end of the day a lot of time the actors are the ones who – well, the actor’s the only one who has to be on stage. Like with any professional sports, the coaches get to say a lot. But at the end of the day, they don’t have to play the game. The players play...
But it is important to have a really strong relationship with your coach or your director or your scenic designer. You know, these are relationships you learn in the professional world how to integrate those people into the entire process. So I would say that there were plenty of times in grad school where even just by stepping out in a certain costume or on a certain set or with a certain direction or – from my end – a certain voice I had prepared, a certain choice I had made about a character, even just stepping out into that first set was like stepping straight into some dog shit.
Virginia: You put yourself in a vulnerable place.
Bryce: Here’s a good one: I created a show in school at the Yale Cabaret. It was a clown show. And I don’t mean clown like circus clown, I mean, sort of like Bill Irwin style – and we built it outside. We did a show outside in the courtyard, you know, beautiful setting. We had a giant staircase, fire escape staircase, coming down and a little stage built out there, and a window. We had all these bits built in and people could walk by and see it from outside. It was really quite wonderful. But we had to, by law, have one performance inside for, I think, wheelchair accessibility or something. And so we put so much work into getting the show together that we never really planned out how we were going to do it indoors. And, you know, it was all done on a shoestring anyway. And so when we did the show inside, one of my teachers came,...came to that show, the one we had to do inside.
Virginia: Was this person a teacher that you wanted to impress?
Bryce: Yeah, I wanted to impress this person, who undoubtedly would have a lot of helpful criticism, who I was really excited to show that I had followed through on my impulse to create something like this. And sure enough she came on the night that we had to do it inside. Or maybe it was raining or something; I don’t know. Nevertheless, we found ourselves before the show, the three of us, the three person show , trying to talk through how we were going to do the show inside with all these things that are normally done outside, like a whole bit done with bringing a trunk down a set of stairs, in a small, low-ceilinged underground theatre with none of that. And at the end of the day, we just had to do it. And my teacher came up to me afterwards with a big smile on her face. I said, “Oh, no, you’re here tonight?” She said, "Yes, and that was terrible!...Congratulations! You’ve tasted it. Now you know what it tastes like.”
And it’s true. It really was terrible. I mean, it was really bad. This is a show, I’m proud to say, got lots of laughter outside. Indoors, we’re lucky if we got any. It was only an hour show, and, oh man, it was a rough hour. But to see her levity about that, the fact that it was really bad, and that it had given me the opportunity to experience it, and I had come out on the other side of it okay and realize, Oh, well, if we’d had more time, and yeah, that was terrible. Ha ha, you know, to laugh at it and myself.
Again, it’s like changing that perspective, the value judgment. Here I am at the Yale School of Drama creating my own show for people who have paid to see me, and it’s terrible. I mean like that’s AMAZING! How many people can say that? I don’t know, it definitely introduced me to what it feels like to fail and move on and recover and look back and laugh and say I made a mess back there. I’m sorry.
...Stay tuned for PART THREE of the epic-long Bryce Pinkham interview extraordinaire!
Until then...
Loves,
V
"We are all apprentices in a craft where no one ever becomes a master." - Ernest Hemingway
“Anybody who’s made it will tell you, you can make it. Anyone who hasn’t made it will tell you, you can’t.” - John Mayer
Speaking of people who are "making it"...Here's a hugely inspiring interview with my friend and Yale grad Bryce Pinkham.
It's such a privilege to live in New York and be able to sit down and have lunch with a true professional and down-to-earth-all-around-great-guy like Bryce. He took the time to sit down with me and open-up about all things "creative process" and really give a no-bullshit look at what he's done to get where he is now...and how he handles the resistance...(the thoughts in his own head that could keep him from plugging away at his acting career)...but clearly, he's been able to make things happen in spite of any fears/doubts/obstacles.
Next month he's opening a show on Broadway!!! He's landed the role of Carl Bruner in the Broadway production of Ghost: The Musical!!! Whoooo hooooo! Check out this sneak-peek video....
Previews for Ghost: The Musical begin March 15, 2012 and Opening is April 23, 2012. Click HERE to buy tickets.
Congratulations, Bryce, on this AMAZING opportunity to share your work on Broadway. Sending you big-time luck and broken legs! Thank you so much for sharing about your creative life!!!
Disclaimer: Watch out, folks. You are about to fall in love with these blue eyes...
(The following interview was conducted at Cellini Restaurant on E. 54th St. in New York City on January 6, 2012.)
Virginia: Okay, go ahead. We're recording...
Bryce: My name is Bryce Pinkham, and I grew up in Northern California, outside of San Francisco. And I went to undergrad at Boston College. I went to graduate school at the Yale School of Drama in Connecticut. And I now live in Brooklyn…I’m an actor here in New York City.
Virginia: What did you study in undergrad?
Bryce: I didn’t go to school to study acting. I decided the place where I wanted to go to school because of the atmosphere and the academics – and if there was a place to continue the hobby of theatre acting I had developed as a kid that that would be a great thing as well. And so, I found that at BC. I did end up majoring in theatre, but I also studied communications and got a very broad liberal arts education, studied the classics and all that, a lot of reading. Which I look back on now and think that I’m so glad I did that. I don’t know that I had thought it out this well, but I’m so glad I made that choice as opposed to saying, no, I really want to try the acting thing so I’m going to go to a conservatory setting. Cause I think one of the most important things to being an actor is knowing how to do lots of things, and so that prepared me.
Virginia: So now you live in Brooklyn, and are you currently a member of any of the actor’s unions?
Bryce: I’m a member of Actor’s Equity. And I’m a member of what’s called a “must join” for both SAG, Screen Actors Guild, and AFTRA, American Federation of Television and Radio Artists. Which means the next job I do for them I have to join the union. So basically I’ve done something like one or two jobs for each of those. They give you a sort of free pass your first round and then the next assignment they say, okay, we want to start making some of your money, too. And so the next thing I do I’ll probably put the entire paycheck toward joining the union.
Virginia: But inevitably, if you want to have a professional career...you have to join eventually, I would assume.
Bryce: Yeah, it’s very hard to get the jobs that we all want to get without being a member of the unions. But there’s certainly plenty of jobs out there for people developing their careers who are not a member of the unions....And some of the best work you can actually do is non-union because you can practice. For example, on film, you can get together on a student film, and it’s a non-union job and you’re not going to get paid much, but it gives you a chance to practice something. It’s lower stakes.
Virginia: So, totally changing the subject. For the record, would you share with the readers...how do you know me, exactly?
Bryce: Well, we knew each other in another life, as aspiring young thespians when it was just for fun and it didn’t have a lot of big ideas. And by “it” I mean performing, specifically – you know. Acting in musical theatre is what we did together, but before we had attached all these ideas of "art" and "why is this important to our country?" and, you know, "what’s it going to be like when I give my first awards speech?" It was about "this is something I want to do over the summer cause I like the other people who do it and I like the way it makes me feel. It’s just fun."
Virginia: Do you think that you have retained elements of that in your current work?
Bryce: Yes.
Virginia: I mean, what you just described. It sounds like the greatest job description ever, you know, just getting together with your friends and doing something fun that you’ll enjoy.
Bryce: I think it’s important to keep in-touch with that side, with that version of you as a performer because there are plenty of reasons to not do it. And those are all reasons that didn’t exist to that little one. They just love the sound of applause. I have one teacher who describes it as, you know, the moment in middle school, when the curtain goes down and all the kids behind the stage are like freaking out, “Oh, my god, we did it. Can you believe it?! We made it through.” And all the parents and the audience are sitting there, “Yeah, you know, it wasn’t that bad." (laughs)...And I think it’s important to stay in-touch with that spirit because it can kind-of carry you through some of the harder times. And also I think it's important for you to get back to a place where you were just less in your head and more in your body.
Virginia: Talk to me about your transition from it being a hobby, and then what made you decide to have it be your career?
Bryce: I did a play in college that was basically a Commedia Dell'arte Moliere one act. That was literally the most fun I think I’ve had. Not only the most fun, but the hardest thing I’ve ever done. And I had never felt like that before. I never felt better about anything. And I sort of had this moment like, well, if I could in some way reproduce this, even every couple of years, you know, in between all the other stuff. I remember as a little kid thinking, "If there’s one thing I do like to do and that’s play...and there’s one thing I don’t like to do and that’s work. And if I could find a way to make those things the same thing, I’m pretty sure I’ll be happy." I think that’s how a kid looks at it. So then as a sophomore in college, I said, "Well, this is something that could be work and is undoubtedly fun. And I’d regret it if I didn’t take a shot at this." And as we’re talking now, I’m still taking a shot.
I’m not like other actors that say, okay, give me this and I’ll see you when I retire. I’m a little more like...So I’ve trained two years seriously at Boston College when I said, "Okay, I’m going to try this for real," the second two years. And then three years of grad school. That’s five total years. When I graduated grad school, I said, "Okay I’m going to give myself five corresponding years to see how this goes. And at the end of five years, I’ll be 30 years old, first of all. And second of all, I’ll have a better idea of what a life like this might sort of look like, what sort of trajectory professionally I’m on. And if’s something I would like, I would enjoy staying in, I would enjoy the lifestyle. So then I’ll go from there. But if I don’t, I give myself permission and the freedom to say I’ve had it." But at the same time, as I said, I’ve dedicated five years to this. I’m not going to quit after one year cause I don’t get into a show or I can’t get my rent acting. The years I’m going to put into it on the other side, preparing for it, at least. So I think It’s important to keep perspective on how much you owe yourself in terms of time.
Virginia: You just mentioned doing other jobs besides acting. Can you share with us maybe some of the other survival jobs you’ve had to pay the bills when you haven’t had enough acting work?
Bryce: Yeah. I did have an acting job right out of school. I’m very lucky. And then I finally moved to New York. And I was working three part-time jobs. None of them were full time. One as a tutor, I was tutoring writing, which was something I learned to do in my liberal arts background. I was teaching soccer to little kids, so I was a soccer coach. It was more like soccer daycare with very safe surroundings and very safe soccer balls. And then I was – surprise, surprise – waiting tables as well. So that was a rough couple of months because that really was three part-time jobs that all had slightly conflicting schedules. And I was trying to audition for the jobs I really wanted in between all of that. Relatively speaking, I’ve had it pretty lucky. But I look back on that and say, "Oh, yeah, you made it through that time, so whatever time you’re going through now is nowhere near as hard as that. There’s no reason you should be down on yourself or worried."
Virginia: Absolutely. I wanted to ask you about your experience with the whole idea of – you know, a lot of actors think their job is, you know, when you’re on stage. But what you actually learn when you graduate from school is that your job, as an actor, is to audition. And I want to hear your opinion on that.
Bryce: Definitely. Some of the best advice I ever got was...what’s most important is how you use your down time, your time in between jobs, whether it’s working on your own material, working on a blog, working on a writing project, working on a one-man show, something to keep your muscles, your creative and physical muscles ready so that when that audition comes you won’t feel like "I haven't acted in so long" or "I haven’t thought like a character in so long" or "I haven’t performed a song in forever." So the down time actually becomes part of the job. You get used to it. You come to expect it. And then when it shows up, you go, okay, cool, now I can do those projects I’ve been wanting to do for awhile. So I’ve learned to try and fill the spaces in between jobs with things that make me still feel like an actor and things that make me still feel on my game. Does that answer the question?...
Oh!--that thing about auditioning too....I guess your job is auditioning. I’m never busier than when I don’t have a job. Because I’m running around preparing, you know, sometimes three or four auditions a week, and we’re talking both musical theatre, TV and film, voiceover, commercial,... doing many different things trying to prepare. And if I had – I haven’t had to lately, but if I had a survival job on top of that, then it would be fitting it in that schedule. So that’s really the hardest part - to get the job. We’re trained for that part. That’s what the training is for. Once you get the job, you don’t have to work to prove that it’s yours. But the hard part is proving you deserve it at the audition.
Virginia: So I have just one quick detour into the financial world, since we’re talking about jobs and, you know, making a living and stuff like that. So we just finished 2011. What percentage of your income would you say came from your acting in 2011 versus other jobs unrelated to acting?
Bryce: Um, only for that – I’m sure they exist, but I can’t think of them. I would say I funded myself entirely with acting jobs this year.
Virginia: Congratulations!
Bryce: Thank you.
Virginia: That’s amazing! That’s a huge accomplishment.
Bryce: Yes, it is. I mean, that’s not to say I funded myself WELL, you know, but I’m not in debt....There’s a certain commitment that I made at a certain point in the year when I said, no, I’m not going to search for that survival job because it will take me out of my ability to search for these other things. And to audition well you’ve got to be preparing, and it’s a full-time thing. I also had the benefit of a couple of really nice jobs that gave me some chunks of money that I could sit on for a couple of months. So to be clear, I wasn’t a paid actor for all of 2011, but I did live off the money that I made as a paid actor.
Virginia: And was this the first year that you've earned all of your income from acting related work…I mean, since you’ve graduated from Yale?
Bryce: I graduated in 2008...Yeah, definitely not 2009, and I don’t think 2010. So yeah, I would say that’s probably the first year that that’s taken place. Like I said, I’m sure there’s something …because when jobs come, you know, two weeks to be an administrative assistant for somebody that pays 20 bucks an hour and I look at my schedule and I say, ok....Savings is the most important thing. When you consider grad school and consider being an actor, save, save, save. Save as much as you can. I mean I know it hard.
Virginia: How close are you to paying off those student loans at this point? Do you still have them?
Bryce: Oh, yeah, I’ve got a sizable chunk of student loans.
Virginia: From undergrad and grad?
Bryce: From graduate school. My parents gave me my undergrad education. But they told me that grad school was on me. Which I mean I wouldn’t have had it any other way....But I think what’s important and what can be a hard initially in this lifestyle is when somebody offers you something, I’m not always the sort of person to take it, to say, "Well, I don’t know that I deserve that what you’re offering me, that free meal or what have you." But I’ve had to learn that there are certain situations where you just have to say thank you. Because specifically, when it has to do with money, because – I don’t want to get too sidetracked on this, but the system - of specifically theatres in our country- it’s such that nobody in New York – this may sound scary, but nobody in New York, except for people who are getting paid on Broadway in lead parts, are acting on the stage and making a living wage from that alone. They just don’t pay enough. And it’s not their fault. Most of the theatres are not for profit and they’re underfunded. I’m not blaming them. I’m just saying that’s the state of affairs.
So even if you are working in your chosen field and loving every minute of it, the stage actor off-Broadway doing important work, working with directors you’ve wanted to work with all your entire life, you may not be able to pay the bills. You may be making less than you would on unemployment. So when those chances come and someone says, “Hey, do you want to do a commercial?” you have to not necessarily sell your soul for it –
Virginia: But you’re going to be scrubbing toilets and smiling.
Bryce: Yeah. I have a voice-over audition today for (**very largecompany that will remain unnamed**). And truth be told, it's not my favorite company in the world. But if they offered me a check for $8000 for an hour and a half’s worth of work in a studio, I’d take it in a heartbeat and I have. I’ve done a voice-over for them before. I did an hour and a half in a studio, and in over the year I think I’ve gotten $8000 from those residuals. Initially I felt bad about it. Then I thought, well, what am I saying?! I’m dedicated to these higher ideals about me as a person. I don’t feel great about this company, what they’ve done to our country or their style of eating, and all that stuff. At the end of the day, they’re helping me in a small way, and I’m helping them in an even smaller way. And I, you know, I take the money and run because I still want to do the off-Broadway stuff.
Virginia: It can help to finance your life so that you can then dedicate you energy to the projects that are really worthy of doing...and I wanted to segue into the project that you did at Guantanamo. And also just talk about your writing and being published in American Theatre Magazine. You know, that’s become a part of your artistry as well. Not only being an actor but, you also did the blog for Orphans Home Cycle at the Signature Theatre. So how have you integrated your writing into your acting?
Bryce: Well, this is one of the things – for example -- that you can do in your down time that keeps you feeling engaged in an artistic conversation and also helps you explore your own ideas about things, about what it is to be an actor, the power of theatre and these things. You know, it’s like what you’re doing. It’s like if I can take my experience and in some way by transferring it to the page or the screen, as it were, help someone else better understand the material, as you know you mentioned the blog I did for the Orphans Home Cycle, or better understand something about what it means to be a working actor, in the case of the Guantanamo trip – which I’ll talk on in a second – better understand what on earth is going on down there and also see through the example, the power and the strength of what it is they want to do. And it renews their own sense of commitment to that, then I’ve served a greater purpose other than – well, my head shot is in American Theatre Magazine. It’s not about that...And the writing, you know, started in grad school, really.
Virginia: Were you given formal opportunities to write or was this something as part of the Yale Cabaret?
Bryce: No, I was asked to write a speech, a personal statement, for The Actors Center. They hold a thing called The Actors Congress. And the first one, they wanted a couple of people in their first year in grad school to write something about what it was like to be in grad school. And one of my teachers asked me to write and I did. They had me come to New York and give it as a speech at The Actors Congress. I just got some really nice feedback from it. This is something I enjoy doing -- writing. It’s a creative outlet but also sort of investigating what the hell's going on in my life and lots of others. I guess the point is it started then and continues to do that for me, so I try to force myself to do it whenever I have the opportunity. Which came up when I came to Guantanamo with this group, Theatre of War, that does readings of ancient Greek plays and other plays as well, for military audiences, in an attempt to bring about a discussion about, in this case, PTSD and soldier suicide. I’ve done it a couple of other times in the states and then was asked to go to Guantanamo with them. I asked them if I could write a piece on it. Actually, they initially said no, we’ve got The New Yorker coming with us to do an exclusive on it, so we can’t really have you doing anything on it. Well, it turns out The New Yorker didn’t end up coming. And so I said, "Can I write?" "Yeah, sure." So I wrote down notes while I was there, got back and sat down and tried to put, you know, thoughts on paper. That’s sort of the sum total of it.
Virginia: I wish that they had it posted on-line. The last time I went to look for it, it was only in print. Cuz, you know, they have some of the articles on-line and some of them aren’t. I think they do that to protect themselves, you know, so you will actually subscribe. But I really wanted to link to it, but I couldn’t actually find it...I would actually like to post it on the blog, have it available....I bet if I wrote them a letter I could probably get their permission.
Bryce: I could get you the email of the person for you to write to.
Virginia: Yeah. Absolutely, that would be great. Because if I could link to it I’m sure people will be interested in reading it, you know, especially after reading what you said about it.
(I did write to Bryce's editor at American Theatre...and, at my request, they put up a link to Bryce's article online!!! So you guys can all read it! Whoo-hoo!... Thanks, Nicole!)
I read this article on the subway on my way to work one day...and as sooooon as I got above ground...I had to call Bryce and leave him a practically sobbing/ridiculously ecstatic voice mail about how incredible the article was and how much I LoVED it...at like 8:45am.
